In this 2-part video report, MSNBC revealed the findings of their investigation, in which the most frequent lottery winners were almost always retailers.
To view the report, please click on Part 1 of the report below. When Part 1 has finished playing, continue by clicking Part 2 of the report.
It boils down to: The more You Play, the more You Win...
As was the case in Ontario, methinks there may be more to it than simple luck.
It's like someone telling you that you die to get the reward of your life.
It all luck or we play alot. When did they prove this as a consistant system.
I play a lot too I don't see 1 % of their result.
they cash tickets at 33%. i know a store that does this with pick 4 winnings. they buy the tickets for the claim form at 33% off.then they give cash on the spot . i didnt really watch the video, i just know thats a tactic
The "I / we / he / she plays a lot." is a B.S. statement when it's not supported by proof. Demonstrate this statement to be true by showing documentation that you have "played a lot". In many cases they can't because they did not ask the seller for a receipt of the sale, and yes, you can get a receipt for a lottery sale. Or, they don't have all the losing tickets that comes from "playing a lot." Another way to tell they are lying is questioning them about where they bought the ticket. As you seen, if you watched the videos, any instant response that has a hesitation in response or an "Uhhhh?" reply is really a clue. I know where I buy tickets and when I buy them, so asking me about that place is going to get an instant response, "Oh yeah, I was there on Monday and I just stopped in while I was doing some shopping. I remember because it was cold and rainy that day. I usually stop by there a lot..."
Now, enough about the winning side of this. There is a flip side that goes along with the winning. If you "play a lot" and "win a lot", then you also must by the Random Laws of the Universe, "LOSE A LOT." Simple, when you play that much, you lose at a rate that is consistent with the probabilities of the game. So, now the question becomes, "What kind of losses would be reasonable for a certain number of wins?"; well, there's an answer to that. Given that all things are equal and the Random Laws of the Universe didn't for some reason just seem to fall apart in close proximity of that person; we can approximate their losses based on their winnings. By example, we'll use the odds of 1 : 10,000 as a guideline and we'll make this a generic enough an equation to fit most situations.
So, finding the equation is very simple, just multiply both sides of the odds and you'll see. As an example, if I won 25 jackpots on a lottery with the odds of 1 : 10,000 in winning the jackpot, then my playing should approximate to 25 x (1 : 10,000) or 25 : 250,000. That value is the ratio of Wins : Losses. My approximate number of plays must be about 25 + 250,000 or 250,025 plays; approximately, but, you don't have to take my word for it. I "play a lot" too, only my playing is documented and it doesn't cost me very much. My playing is all done right here at the Lottery Post by using the Predictions feature of the website. All you have to do is look at my wins and losses and you'll see there is proof of the previous statements. Just look at my Pick 4 Prediction Postings and look a what my winnings are in relation to my losses; they are no where near the lucky streak those "play a lot" people are claiming.
Most of the tickets are 3 and 4 number games. The winning tickets are probably being cashed by these retailers for others who do not have proper ID or know they owe money - no U.S. ID, back taxes, child support, etc. which most states will cross reference with the social security number - and the state will take that out of their winnings. The retailer cashes the customer's ticket and takes a "cut" of the winnings for their "service" and to cover taxes due.
As far as I know, in most states, it is legal for a person off the street to enter into an agreement to cash a ticket for someone else and split the winnings, but the Lottery Retailer agreement signed by the store who sells lottery tickets may forbid this and the store could lose their license to sell lottery tickets if they are investigated by the lottery and the proof is there.
The store owners interviewed seemed anxious and nervous. They should have smiled and just said "I am a very lucky person" and not provide any further explanation. Or they could add "and buy my 'How to Win the Lottery' ebook online at xxxyyyzzz.com
I am going to agree with you Editgap, even those that play alot, they end up broke, not rich like these retailers and families are doing. I don't know how they are doing it but it isn't legal. And this is regarding the scratch off tickets and not the pick 3 or pick 4.
Ok, that is true, many people might owe child support, taxes or not be a American citizen and they want the money without having to go through any trouble and the retailer is going to cash their ticket in to make that money. No, it isn't right but the Lottery isn't doing anything to stop it so the retailers are going to continue to do it.
First of all, I don't think you can cheat the lottery. Its too random, but I know you can win without spending alot of money.
I've also have spoken to customers that have won $1000. or more, only to go cash it in, and have the money taken for child support, and walk out with nothing.
If you win p/4 or P/3 or maybe even a scracher, there's nothing illegal selling to someone else, for what ever the reasons. The bearer of the ticket is the winner. Maybe you owe child support, no ID, or it will throw you into another tax bracket that will cost you thousands. Just maybe, your willing to sell your ticket for half it value or less, so you get something rather than nothing.
One last thing, when playing p/4, you don't have to spend a fortune, all you have to know is its history. What goes around comes around, but how could you, unless you charted all 10000 number.
I've laways assumed that most of the excessive wins by retailers are because of the number of winning tickets that come through the door. Ocasionally they simply cheat their customers, but I'm sure that it's mostly a matter of buying the winners for a fraction of their value. Those who bought the tickets may have many reasons for selling them at less than face value, but I expct the various reasons all come down to thinking they'll keep more by settling for a smaller payment under the table, or avoiding the government for one reason or another.
"or it will throw you into another tax bracket that will cost you thousands."
Anyone who thinks that's a good reason to sell is probably an idiot who has no idea how taxes work. The most you will pay in taxes is 35% of the prize to the federal government, and whatever your state's maximum rate is. You don't get to keep it all, but you never lose money n the deal. I suppose there are a few people out there who would pay the maximum tax and will come out a bit ahead if the retailer will pay them 60 to 65% of the face value, but I doubt that's a very common scenario. What's the retailer's tax bracket? Unless their claiming a fairly modest taxable income their profit is fairly small if they pay 60 to 65% of face value. I'd guess that you might get 50%. That's a good deal if you're a deadbeat who's trying to cheat an ex out of alimony or child support, or avoid some other debt that's public record. If you think it saves on your taxes you're wrong.
I'm not sure you're getting what this is all about.
It's not about how random the lottery is. We all know that nobody is able to win prizes of greater than $5,000 that often -- even daily players.
It's about retailers that are probably involved in schemes in which they check customers' tickets to see if they are winners, inform the customer they have not won, and then take the winning tickets and claim the prize money for themselves.
If you check the Lottery Post news section for Ontario Lottery news stories, you find stories like this.
Or retailers paying players under the table so they can avoid back taxes and child support. Either way, it's shady business.
Indeed! Retailers collecting for illegal aliens too.
there are definitely some that let the retailer check their numbers and retailers tell them not winners, then proceed to tear and throw ticket in basket. They later tape it together and claim the lotto or scratcher at Lotto headquarters
To me it sounds like Chris is running out of stories to go after. Now he is chasing people that win lotteries. I play quite often. I don't win that much, but some people do. Just because these people play a lot, he is trying to find a story there. Why don't he do a story on BIG winners, what they did withthe money, how family and friends reacted to them as well as how they are treated differently, etc.
I wonder how much of a cut they get when they claim tickets for people. 1/2 maybe.
For everything legal, there is something that can be done "illegal". If they are cashing tickets for others, they better not get caught. But also to say this, there are folks who play and when they think that they have the number, they do step on it and try to knock it out the box. I know folks who do play like that. They don't play every single draw like that except when they think their number is close to coming out. It makes sense to me. I am sure that if they had checked in Ky along the TN/Ky line, they would have found a few players who may or may not work for a store who have chalked up large wins. I believe though that these people (in the video) are buying tickets from real winners at less than face value and cashing them in. If a person had a $5,000.00 ticket and didn't want to "do the tax stuff", and agreed to sell their ticket for 50% of it's value, the buyer has a built in 100% profit. i am sure that someone running a business could find enough deductions (losing tickets) to take the heat off.
I feel a sting coming on.
The video report didn't indicate whether these winning tickets were scratch-offs or terminal print outs or both. It would be hard to scam a terminal game with a independent draw except where they dupe the playing public by telling them they lost on a winning ticket and then keeping it to cash in. I've heard of retailers scanning the bar codes of scratch-off tickets and pulling out the winners and cashing them in then putting the no prize or low value prize tickets back out to be sold to the public. Yes I've heard some lotteries will flag multiple scanning of the same ticket to prevent fraud but this security measure probably isn't set up in every state and the video report of lottery officials declining to be interviewed on such an important topic demonstrates they don't take stopping fraud that seriously. Since the retailers stock their lottery displays no one would be able to see that a length of perforated roll of scratch-offs has been tampered with. If you scan a roll of 50 connected tickets and the 26th ticket was a big winner then put the length of 1 to 25 out then replace it with 27 to 50 who in the public would notice?
Having "lucky" relatives win all the time smacks of someone trying to hide their tracks. Having big wins from not only your own store but other nearby retailers who also sell lottery tickets reeks of collusion.
This is one of the reasons I don't buy scratch-offs.
(I know I told this story before)
I was once, standing in line at a store that had one lottery terminal and was being held up by a man who was calling out a long list of 4 digit numbers. The line was long and I had gone to the store while I was on my lunch break from work, as had the majority of the people in the line. People were getting impatient.
When the guy finished and was walking away, someone made a comment out loud about him spending so much money on the lottery. This made the guy return a comment, "I cash in 3 to 4 times a week on straight hits. He walked out.
Someone inquired as to just how much he had spent. The store clerk answered, $400.00, he does it all of the time.
This happened about 3 or4 years ago. I haven't seen him since then, but then, I don't frequent that store much either.
I can see retailers buying off tickets from people who want to avoid paying taxes. Paying taxes on lottery wins is not all fun. I'd rather not, unless it is hugh jackpot that will make it worth the trouble.
That was my first thought, but think about this:
"If a person had a $5,000.00 ticket and didn't want to "do the taxstuff", and agreed to sell their ticket for 50% of it's value, thebuyer has a built in 100% profit."
That's not true in a world where somebody has to "do the tax stuff." If you cash a winning ticket for $5000 you've got $5000 in taxable (and reported) income, but your real income was only $2500. If you have no state tax and are in the 25% bracket you'll owe $1250, so oyur profit is $1250. Yeah, you can claim some losses, but if you're a lottery retaile (or related to one) the IRS isn't likely to be satisfied with a box of losing tickets as proof of your loss, especially if the tickets are mostly from your own store and you've won with tickets from other stores.
I'm thinking that 1/3 may be about what it takes to make it worth the hassles, including the possible risk of losing your status as a retailer. At least if the lotteries were serious about preventing it.
"I cash in 3 to 4 times a week on straight hits. He walked out."
Yeah, everybody who's spending a lot of money says that. Kind of makes you wonder how the lottery would be turning a profit if it was true.
KY floyd said: Kind of makes you wonder how the lottery would be turning a profit if it was true.
The lottery makes most of it's money selling scratch offs.
thought scratch offs have best odds, return 60% of jackpot too
I think a lot of you are missing the lightbulb here. A store cashing in 50+ tickets of large amount prizes has to have a ridiculously lucky to get 50 people to split the ticket with them for whatever reason. They are doing in constantly and similar amounts at regular intervals. There is something seriously sinister going on here than involves a bit more than luck. And the store owner who's wife is winning a tremendous amount of money playing "a lot" has a lil smth going on too. A lot of folks in this site play RELIGIOUSLY....show me proof ANYONE of you have won regularly large prizes as these retailers....OPEN YOUR EYES PPL...DUMB LUCK DOES NOT STRIKE YOU 49 TIMES AT 30 DAY INTERVALS FOR $2500 EACH.
So like there couldn't be a business that cashes tickets on a regular basis even to the point that the word has spread out from the surrounding communities and now the guy has people walking in several times a week to get tickets cashed. Even legitimate tickets are reported as well as anybody that might wander in wanting to split there winnings.
Cut some people some slack we had a store near me that did it they got caught cashing tickets for people who didn't want to pay taxes and now that store doesn't have a lottery anymore.
There are crooked retailers everywhere.
These "Lucky winners" should tell this to the convicted embezzler in Kansas...he played a lot as well and I'll bet his odds were NOT as good as theirs!!!
If you worked the counter for 8 hours, it's easy to pick up on the "winning or losing" batch....then you just call a friend or relative to buy tickets from that batch without you risking your job. Think about it....many times when you go into the same gas station the person working the counter usually has a friend/relative hanging around keeping them company while they work....have you ever noticed them scratching off tickets?
Heck, I've seen clerks buy tickets themselves or write down pick 3/4 numbers that a customer ahead just played. They'll say, he's pretty lucky...wanna know what he played so u can play it to? I'm playing it right after work.
I believe that there are truly lucky people in this world...but come on...not THIS lucky THIS often!
About a couple of months ago I witnessed about 5-7 Mexicans buying a roll of $10.00 tickets for a price of $300.00. They were all counting out the money and the store owner came from the back with a brand new roll...they all huddled together with the store manager, talked a bit and then he scanned in the tickets and gave it to them. I wonder what kind of deal they worked out to make them all have to talk really low. I'm assuming that he probably agreed to cash in the winning tickets for them for a fee since they may not have had identification....I don't know...but why hide the fact that you're buying a roll of tickets? What was all the secrecy about? I'd like to know how many winning tickets this store owner has purchased. It would be hard to figure out since South Carolina allows you to claim tickets anonymously.
very true....
moral of story is to always check your ticketyourself!
It looks like those retailers are "buying" winning tickets from players who don't want it known they won or for some other reason. I'm assuming because they told Chris Hanson "they were very lucky", the retailers didn't want anyone to know they profited and by how much. I see nothing illegal because the taxes are being paid and the state lottery should already know they are cashing an extraordinary amount of winning tickets; they gave Hanson the printouts.
"I'm thinking that 1/3"
About the same as if two people share a $5000 winning ticket, the one cashing the ticket takes 1/3 off the top for taxes, and they split the rest. Since those retailers cashed at least 25 winning tickets in the last year, I'm guessing it's more like the player gets 50% and the retailer's profit is after taxes.
A much bigger problem is the retailers and clerks that tell players winning tickets under $599 won nothing or the tickets are worth much more than the clerk pays them. I doubt any of the retailers buying winning tickets are involved in that and if Chris Hanson wants a real story, he should go after the retailers that are cheating the players.
A few days ago, a Dollar store owner in Tarrytown NY took off having something to do with Lottery fraud. he just vanished, store is in shambles.
These retailers cash lottery tickets for persons who can't report income such as people on welfare, workers comp., people who are illegal aliens, owe child support etc. etc.
That's why the one guy on the video couldn't remember buying the $5K lottery ticket at th mall, becasue he didn't buy it. He probably gave $2,500.00 for the $5K ticket.
They pay 2 to 1 on most tickets to illegal aliens, people on welfare, workers comp. Etc. They also do the old, "nope, not a winner" scam by keeping the ticket, or like some else said, tearing it up and then tapping it up and cashing it later on.
A dollar store owner in Tarrytown NY has vanished just last week, store is empty, ransacked. It is alleged that he pulled off some kind of lottery scam.
These guys are creeps, regardless of what "awards" they have.
If you believe that bull, I have a nice waterfront property I would love to sell you in Florida!!
Those people 98% were not born American. There is no way they could win 65 times in less than three month!!! I hope the lottery Commision takes note and puts in Video footage showing how they win!! I think they must be cashing in other winners tickets!!!
That really upsets me with I play 5 days a week and only win back $2.00 or $3.00!! As Ricky use to say something smell rotten in Denmark!!
Lots of Luck Serious players
Joey
I honestly think there scanning all the tickets they recieve and they pick out all the winners. I've seen someone working at a gas station do that before.
It is obvious what they are doing. I win; they buy my ticket and make a profit. I on the other hand, for tax purposes, I have no income from lottery wins. The money I got for selling my ticket do not get reported as income. That's the way it is. . At the races in any track, you can find people that will claim your prize for you. They tell you what they will expect up front. I win $2000; they will claim the prize for $400 - $500. I pocket $1500 - $1600 unreported income. That's the way it is.
This the secret , most time the retailers buy the tickets from the winners because the winners do not want to pay taxes directly on a win. The retailer buy the ticket less the value minus tax. People do this to hide their identity or get their winning faster thru the retailer cash it as his.
yea def.. but its RANDOM though because most people that play scrach off tickets they can see it on the ticket if they are winners or not OF COURSE. for example I myself. i play scrach off ticket i scrach it off its very simpel the KEY is you must know how to play the scrach off game. if i see i match someting on the ticket than i cash it in. i dont just give to retailer, i check if i am winner or not people are being fooled because most of them DOESNT know how to PLAY the scrach off ticket and they just give it to the retailer to check it on the lottery computer LOOOLLLLL this is WRONG.. DONT DO THAT. yes they might say NO you are not winner and CASH IT for themselves get your ticket back when they scan it for you and go to at least THREE more stores if someting isnt right yes it happens money talks fools walks ahah i just made that up ahahaha. peace people .
Even of average intelligence, the Lottery Retail Clerk has an advantage. Private information that is not provided for consumers provides enough information to Lottery Clerks to figure out best odds on winning scratch-off tickets whilst they are working.....8 hours or more. I happen to believe that if I spent that much time studying the factors...I could win too.
Dont you see? "A Lottery Clerk of average intelligence", watching people buy scratch-Off tickets..lose..win...whatever, they have an advantage over the "joe" who walks in from the street.
Contests usually have explicit rules, for a reason. People involved are not allowed to participate. It would not be accepted any where else, why now? Because the Government has a piece of the pie. Only way it could happen. Sorry, that's the truth. Honestly I should've become a Lottery Clerk.....Cuz "I'd BE RICh BY NOW" ;)
But you "could" see more ......if same info were to be given to each player? yes?
I have Definitelyheard clerks tell their "favorite customers" which roll is a winning roll and which one is not. And they have their friends sitting around in the store scratching away. Once, when this particular clerk was in, I watched and listened as I ate my sandwich. Then I got in line and the next two tcikets I bought were nice winners! It is all a racket, I think. If I overhear how to get the big jackpot, I will be all ears and play...that will be a shared jackpot! LOL!